v0.7 Complaints (<- read this before you start complaining)

[Sadist_Cain]

Originally Posted by [R-PUB]MrD

I've noticed too many people concentrating on tight squad movement to the detriment of their gameplay.

Get Rp's down and keep getting them down in likely areas as you traverse the map fast going for cp's. I've been in squads where the SL meanders over things, talks about waypoints in terms of less than a hundred metres and then places RP's in places where they will be instantly found as they are in the natural path of oncoming enemies.

There are times when the logical movement for our squad is the next cp, leapfrogging enemies, yet I run to the next cp and my squad are still closer to the last cp than the one I'm sat on with the icon above it saying we can take it.

Also players have to realise they need patience. When you are defending a cp, spread out and get down and use voip to identify any movement around you. Running back and forth is heard by the enemy and masks enemy movement noise (until you've used an X-FI card on full ingame settings, maybe you don't realise how critical this is?)

Also the deviation issue means that running around means you are going to die as enemy will shoot you as you have increased deviation. The idea of the deviation changes is that the defenders will have the advantage. Those displaying ADHD like symptoms ingame are costing their team its cohesion and effectiveness. Think about this carefully.

Firing off rounds to test your gun is working is the most immensely silly thing to do too, the numbers of players I've seen doing this is ridiculous. Have patience and you can win effectively, destroy noise discipline methods for your squad and you are ruining the other players experience/fun.

And don't fire the instant you see enemies, let them come closer and nade and spray them after using voip to announce enemies movement path. Fire at the first one coming out of cover and the rest of them know where you are, the advantage of ambushing is gone and it's the end, again!


If only you guys all lived in the same area, the military trained amongst us could take you out in the field with sticks for guns and teach you about proper squad movements, noise discipline, fields of fire, effective communication, etc. so you can implement this ingame.

I've laid in the grass for two hours at night waiting to 'ambush' a patrol on exercise and you feel dog tired, but when the trip flares go off, the thunderflashes are thrown, you all let rip full auto (live round ambush exercise with pop up targets) with rifles, GPMG and a low powered mortar joining in, you end up afterwards jogging away from the ambush like you've been blessed with infinite energy, with smiles on your faces trying to put as much distance between the ambush location and yourselves as possible! When things go down well, the enjoyment factor is there, when people do silly things it all gets a bit frustrating and a headache develops.

Good post the only thing I'd disagree with is sometimes placing an RP behind enemy lines can be very effective. The RP radios are far quieter in 0.7 and a carefully chosen RP hidden inside a bush, on a steep hill by tree branshes etc. are all excellent lil hidey holes.
Never glitch an RP but hiding them in bushes, under things, on steep slopes, in tiny nooks and crannies etc are all acceptable imo

Advantages

If you have a silent disciplined squad you can spawn behind the enemy advance and attack them from the rear.

If a squadmember dies and they stay around* (*far away from) the RP then with stealth they can give vital recon on enemy movements to the frontline way before they get there, the SL can relay this to the CO and counter attacks can be planned, sometimes minutes in advance.

if the enemy starts moving towards the RP then obviously its time for a new one.
You can never place too many rally points, I'm constantly putting them down all over the place.
This means that by the time the enemy figures out where you're attacking from and they go huntimng for your RP you're long gone.

I get immense satisfaction from withdrawing after a first attack and watching the RP go down as me and the squad reposition the RP somewhere else and then move to eliminate the squad who's confident theyve eliminated us

Moving quietly behind enemy lines allows you to place your squad in an area with maximum effectiveness when they go weapons free

Disadvantages

You'll occaisionally get a child who's all yaay go rambo behind the enemy lines I'm l33t
Inform them politely (sledgehammer) perhaps cohesive squad work with the rest of us is better. Really don't give two short s!!!s about how uber they tell you they are because they're alone shooting in the general direction of a squad.
Some folk need weapons free, weapons hold, and hold fire unless fired upon explained to them.

Hold Fire
In the direct vicinity of the RP behind the lines.
If youre travelling and the only man out of 6 moving who's been spotted, best to get into cover if possible, Withdraw, get healed and put more distance between you and then enemy until you have a plan.

Hold fire unless fired upon

Best for approaching a target, try to move silently calling out target locations to the SL on VOIP but if someone starts to shoot at you then the whole squad should go weapons free to engage the threat and clear it. If the latter happens often the advance has to be pushed up fast once the element of surprise is comprimised the clock is ticking for the enemy to respond to you.
A newbie response is a trickle of resistance one by one meeting the attacking squads 6 guns, A trained response will be the whole defensive squad turning targets onto you.

Weapons Free

Lotsa fun if you've managed to sneak close to the enemy without them knowing and all 6 of you have a target in sight "weapons free..." let loose hell the enemy wont know what's hit them and by the time they find out theres 6 people on the flag dug in defending.

[PhoenixTril]

1. The problem isn't so much with removing squad leader spawns, it's that the alternatives are lacking. Number of spawn points isn't the problem, it's the vulnerability of them. Bunkers can be ripped up in a single salvo. Sometimes, they aren't defensible in the slightest. If a bunker is dead, how do defenders repair it? How do defenders spawn? They can't. And arbitrary timers on getting stuff, especially officer kits, are excruciating. If I had a dime every time I heard, "I have to wait before I can get it.", I'd be able to fund all the PR servers for a month.

2. I didn't need the minimap to find the enemy. I needed the minimap to help coordinate my squad. Are we too bunched up in this forest? Do I have even placement? Where are my guys looking? Are they overlapping without even knowing it? Would they know it if they weren't looking at the minimap? Clans are able to coordinate with VOIP, sure. They know what they're doing, but pubbies are rarely that well coordinated as a squad. The minimap helped squads that would be noncohesive, be cohesive, because we could see where each of us needed to be. Spotting is irrelevant. Knowing where MY people are is crucial.

3. DMR / Sniper rifles seem to be the only weapons that work. Any other weapon, I'm lucky to get a kill in five hours. Once I got my hands on a marksman kit, I had eight kills inside half an hour. I find the problem isn't instant accuracy at 500m, it's any accuracy at all at 50.

[Jaymz]

Originally Posted by PhoenixTril

3. DMR / Sniper rifles seem to be the only weapons that work. Any other weapon, I'm lucky to get a kill in five hours. Once I got my hands on a marksman kit, I had eight kills inside half an hour.

You do realise that makes no sense whatsoever because the DM/Sniper rifles are broken. They deviat wildly no matter how long you settle for...

[PhoenixTril]

I know, that's why this is so hilarious. I can prone-fivecount-fire with an AK and not hit a stationary target at fifty metres, or crouch and tap tap tap and not hit a guy crouched at ten, nor can I hit a guy running towards me, thirty metres in front of me with the chinese scoped-rifleman gun, out of five shots (he could hit me fine, though)...

BUT! I can bean a guy, who's running, with a Chinese DM rifle at 300m, effortlessly.

I'm not even joking.

[Razick]

Again you make no sense because there is no way in hell that you can fire more accurately with a bugged sniper than with a working rifle. Your posts have me confuzzled.

[VipersGhost]

Hey Phoenix I don't know what you are seeing but at 30m's it's really easy to kill a guy using burst firing. You need some practice there or something else is wrong. Now...the DMR. They are bugged BUT...the other night on Ejod I was dropping guys at around 400m's with the M14. They were stationary targets and I had to let the site sit for about 3 full seconds (long time). I had several headshots...though if you move the scope around to much it screws it all up and you have to start again. I don't know what happened but I got some kills with the thing, nothing extrodinary but it worked kinda. I can say I have noticed this with the snipers as well...you have to be completely still for them to be decently accurate. I haven't been using them at 400+ meters though so I couldn't say as to how precise they are.

[PhoenixTril]

Originally Posted by Razick

Again you make no sense because there is no way in hell that you can fire more accurately with a bugged sniper than with a working rifle. Your posts have me confuzzled.

I know, they've got me confused too. I was baffled. I was sitting there, like, "What? I thought these guns were bugged!" And I was getting more kills in an hour than I had in the three previous.

[spitfiRe-]

Anyway, as I said in the other post " I hate to say this .. "
If you are going to keep the deviation system, then you should put in, indeed, a visual aid that tells you when you are stable to shoot.

I don't think that you can modify the game that you can " hold your breath " ( as in CoD 4 ) or what so ever.

That's my point of view of the new aiming system, I don't like it, but I'm starting to adjust. But those constant firefights in prone position are getting annoying.
-> So, to "remove" those prone fights, you should put in when you go prone the same effect as when you jump, meaning that you lose like 5-10 bars of your sprint ( because Irl, proning ain't that easy )

As for the minimap and the Squadleader spawning.
I don't really care for that, but it would be nice to have a few more spawning points, as the commander truck or some other vehicle.

Voila voila

[bumbling_gimp]

Originally Posted by icehollow

If I may, I'd like to suggest some tweaks for the new accuracy system:

1. tighten the dispersion while still a little, and drop recoil of 5.56 rifles a tiny bit.
2. Sprinting and insta proning with little to no accuracy loss is still possible, im not sure how you can work around that, maybe make it a second or so before you can bring up your sights after diving?.
3. Running has same effect on accuracy as walking with sights up ready to go does. Suggest if possible to make the effect less while walking.

hear hear...! number 2 is one of my own particular bugbears too. Add in a delay of a second or so after going prone before being able to take a shot, that would be great.

gimp

[BloodBane611]

Played with both the Marine and Chinese DMRs on qwai, found them both to be extremely useful and accurate between 100-200 meters, against both prone and sprinting targets. So I don't know what the deal is.

SL/Supply Truck/APC spawn removal has definitely helped make the gameplay less arcadey. Now its all about hunting down enemy RPs, instead of finding that hidden SL whos parked 200 meters away and popping guys out his pockets like a kangaroo.

As far as removing the minimap goes, I practiced with my tourny squad on friday and found that maintaining squad cohesion becomes quite challenging without it. I definitely like it, it will reward those of us who train and whip those who don't.

Deviation I'm definitely liking, gotta get some more practice in before I'll be effective with most of these weapons at range. I will say that trying to hit anything beyond 200m with the AK iron sights is impossible for me, which is pretty sweetly realistic.