v1.7.4 Battle Rifles still dont feel right.

[dcm1]

I'm not gonna get long winded here. But basically. Battle Rifles Still Suck! Too little ammo, too much recoil, not enough extra damage. I heard that squad recently buffed it's battle rifles, by introducing a one shot kill to the chest within 25m distance. I think that's a wonderful idea, and should be adopted by PR. However I think that 25m is way too far. And armor should be a factor.

I believe that all full power, .30 caliber type rounds. Should one shot enemies at extremely close range. 5M or less for armored players. 10M or less for unarmored players. Because let's face battle rifles need a buff in cqb.

[[R-MOD]Nate.]

Not sure but I don't think damage can be modified by distance in PR.

[Grump/Gump.45]

Originally Posted by Nate.

Not sure but I don't think damage can be modified by distance in PR.

They can and did change the damage to decrease over distance with the AKM beyond 600 meters, saw it a few updates ago. Accurate to IRL joules or foot pounds of energy loss.

I 100% agree on the battle rifles statement, of course we cant increase ammo though. Battle rifles have way too much semi-auto recoil to reset your aim. Recoil should be halved for semi-auto.

For damage, I think focus should be on improving the damage models on players bodies to be more accurate to IRL vital hitboxes. Even if you completely miss the organ cavity or barely miss outer mass of organs, on top of regular tissue/bone damage, hitting the edge of ribs there is still hydrostatic damage, organs turning, pushing into each other, like a bunch of different types of jello sacks in a larger sack within a cage like frame.

That being said, humans can actually take a lot of damage non-vitally. Graze wounds in game to the outer frame remove visibly at least 1% of health, I know this because I have been hit, didn't bleed but still medic has 1 second of work to do on me.

Absolute outer frame grazing or scrapes should be 1% health reduction as it appears, it would be fracture, dented flesh creating anywhere from a graze scrape to a half circle missing deep scrape missing chunk. But 1-2 inches from frame edge in should be 10% health, very slow or no bleed out rate.

You really only start to see bleed out effects at 75% health as far as I can see, maybe its 85% or 90%, would be easier to tell if I had same medic healing feedback bar that medic has as he is healing me so I see when I stop bleeding.

Battle rifles should be at or near 1 shot kill for un-armored targets to the torso center mass, if torsos could be re-modeled on damage zones based on bullet trajectory to the body missing spine, aorta and trajectory through rib cage or above around the hips hitting only soft tissue and no organs.

Biggest risk in these 2 inches in from the outer rib frame is a round/oval shaped hit box for the edges of aortic branches above the hips. Look at human body diagram, you will see non-vital yet still painful areas a bullet or other object can pass through only hitting body structure.

About 2 inches in from the sides towards center mass both sides, from the frontal body frame angle. Like putting straight sticks straight through a cardboard box edges straight or through one corner outwards the side like this |\1 O 1/| keyboard character diagram.

| = ribs outer frame, 1=organs cavity, O=Organ torso cavity, \/=bullet trajectory into front edge of frame exiting out rear frame edges. This would cause only tissue, bone and blunt energy transfer to the organs with nothing immediately life threatening.

I kind of want to make a video on it using this method but with Jello filled water balloons as different organs plus clusters of tubing for aorta branches above the hips, then use ballistic dummy videos and gunshot trauma surgery videos for comparison.

In game it appears hits to the outer frame outside of 2 inches in towards center mass already cause grazing wounds. At 3 inches in towards center mass IRL, about 1 index finger length towards center from both hip edges is where normal damage should be.

Lets say 80-90% health. For armored targets 2 shots. Even 5.56 can put somebody down in 2 shots, this makes teams unbalanced by faction weapon recoil at times. Especially if people don't treat being MEC as everyone having marksmen rifles.

Close combat with 20 rounds vs 30 round against any BLUFOR is un-balanced, you see how wildly the G3 fires, which even in short automatic bursts is un-controllable plus slower rate of fire. Higher rate of missing too on its hip cone of fire.

[dcm1]

I think the problem also lies with PR's damage system. The intermediate caliber guns are just too powerful. And completely mog the full caliber rifles.

On body shots;
5.56/5.45/5.8: 2 shot kill on soft targets. 3 shots on body armor? Way too powerful.
7.62x39/51/54: 2 shot kill on any target is way too weak.

I do not want to go back the days when G3 was king with one shot kills. But something needs to be done to address the inherit weakness of battle rifles.


I cant remember what game or mod it was(maybe firearms source? Insurgency the mod? I know it was a source engine thing). Where the damage and recoil were just perfect. Chefs kiss.

If I recall correctly;
5.56x45 caliber weapons were 3 shots to the chest to kill. 5 shots against body armor
7.62x39 caliber weapons were 3 shots to the chest. 4 shots against body armor
7.62x51/54 caliber weapons were 2 shots to the chest. 3 shots against body armor
9x19 caliber weapons were 4 shots to the chest. 6 shots against body armor
Shotguns were 00 buck. 9x pellets. Each pellet did as much damage as 9mm bullet. But the shot spread rapidly. So one shotting even body army foes was doable. But only at close range.
Limbs had their own damage multiplier. Either two-thirds or three quarters(cant remember exactly).
Headshots were always a one hit kill. Except for pistols if you had a helmet on.

The general rule was; the more powerful your weapon, the less ammo and more recoil you had.