Muttrah Alternative Layout

[Rhino]

Originally Posted by WingWalker

Probably one of my all time favorite maps in PR.

I remember talking about opening the mountains in the past, but they were not really designed to allow moving though? Rhino?

I would personally love to see tweaks to a map like Muttrah that everyone likes to play, where everyone is used to all the sweet spots and tricks.

Utilizing more areas of the map would be nice, moving the flags to change the fighting environments.

For instance I always liked the Docks area but most action just takes place around the warehouses.

After playing a few days ago, I feel like the fortress should be a hardcore last ditch fight, but winnable by MEC too. Feel like its too easy to pin them into the fortress, or to prevent them from spawning at all.

Totally cutting down the armored vehicles on the map would change things a lot too.

Thanks

I technically never finished Muttrah, there was much I had planned to do and would have liked to do, especially as PR's gameplay has evolved a lot from when it was made (2008 ) and for the map to incorporate those changes better. Like for example, I had hoped to develop the docks up round to the north where the real Muttrah docks has had a big extension made up there just as I was finishing the map and this area would become the initial staging and landing area for the USMC where the vehicle depo etc could be better located and protected, also opening up the rest of the docks for more fighting. Although now it looks like that port has been totally decommissioned other than for cruise ships.

Butt tbh, I don't see me ever finishing the map with everything I hoped to do as I'm simply too busy with r/l stuff and the little bit of time I do have is going towards finishing my Frigate etc.

Originally Posted by Grump/Gump.45

People HATE THINGS RUINING THE FUN, LIKE FLAG BLEED.

I'm sorry Grump I really don't have the time or energy to read all that, it would be nice if you condensed your posts to only the key facts and info especially when you're trying to convince someone of something.

But from what I can see from doing a quick skim read is your problem isn't really with flag bleed or anything like that, it is actually more with the match length and you would like the match to run on for longer. I partly agree with you there I would like to see longer matches but most players do not. Server admins in fact have a setting to increase the ticket ratio for their maps so they can run for longer, but they do not. I suggest you talk with your server admins about adjusting the ticket ratio if you want longer games, or setting up a server yourself with those settings. But what we have found in the past is the majority of players don't want to play a single map for that amount of time.

[Grump/Gump.45]

Originally Posted by InfantryGamer42

New HOG DoD rule and widespread main camping disproves you here. Whiteout ticket bleed, you really do not have any reason to go for flags as they will most likely lose you to much tickets whiteout any benefit while in same time you can do more damage by camping enemy main.

During Insurgency as insurgents we dont have things like ticket bleed to help us. We mop their tickets up manually by killing infantry and assets. Other AAS maps no ticket bleed either like if Russians dont get Mosque on Kafr Halab AAS. We kill them all in attrition.

Many benefits as I said for removing flag bleed, enemy main is right there and has assets ready to push out. But it takes strategy, if you have anti-air vehicle dont leave that behind if taking out tanks with enemy CAS up. Things like that. Max out support and output. There is only 100-200 tickets left per side or even less by the time it gets to the last flag..

I made alot of other points that cross over and reinforce one another for a bigger picture. I read all the long ones other people post.. News articles too, long forums, lots of long things. I for one like to listen to other peoples thoughts and broaden the options. Skimming is a good skill, gets all the good points. But reading is better once you find the good stuff.

We have MEC main right outside the fort on Muttrah with a bleed flag before it south city. Same with Bamyan AAS ALT with the USMC airfield having 2 checkpoint bleed flags right before it. Rendering epic place to fight useless cause never enough tickets left at the end anyways.. Its like skirmish with one or both sides have 200 tickets or less by that point, let it play out.

[Cpt.Future]

Originally Posted by Rhino

Like for example, I had hoped to develop the docks up round to the north where the real Muttrah docks has had a big extension made up there just as I was finishing the map and this area would become the initial staging and landing area for the USMC where the vehicle depo etc could be better located and protected, also opening up the rest of the docks for more fighting.

That would've been amazing! Muttrah definitely feels a bit too cramped for 100 players, it was much better with 64 max.

Originally Posted by Grump/Gump.45

Many benefits as I said for removing flag bleed, enemy main is right there and has assets ready to push out.

More likely scenario: Players will start trolling or leaving the server, because the game is clearly over at that point. That already happens when the steamroll is too fast and the bleed is too slow.

[InfantryGamer42]

Originally Posted by Grump/Gump.45

During Insurgency as insurgents we dont have things like ticket bleed to help us. We mop their tickets up manually by killing infantry and assets.

And whiteout flag bleed on AAS, most people will just go to camp enemy main, because flags will lose one big point of there existence and importance.

Other AAS maps no ticket bleed either like if Russians dont get Mosque on Kafr Halab AAS. We kill them all in attrition.

Originally Posted by Grump/Gump.45

Many benefits as I said for removing flag bleed, enemy main is right there and has assets ready to push out. But it takes strategy, if you have anti-air vehicle dont leave that behind if taking out tanks with enemy CAS up. Things like that. Max out support and output. There is only 100-200 tickets left per side or even less by the time it gets to the last flag..

Why would anybody attack main and lose tickets for no need, when you can just camp it. And lets not forget that in that point enemy team sin 9/10 cases starts trolling each other. As such, there are no assets to push as out.

Originally Posted by Grump/Gump.45

We have MEC main right outside the fort on Muttrah with a bleed flag before it south city. Same with Bamyan AAS ALT with the USMC airfield having 2 checkpoint bleed flags right before it. Rendering epic place to fight useless cause never enough tickets left at the end anyways.. Its like skirmish with one or both sides have 200 tickets or less by that point, let it play out.

Simplistic way of looking. In case of Fort, in ideal world all main bases would be placed outside map borders. For now, that is not case (and maybe impossible or to taxing for DEVs to implement), except for few maps whit outside airfield.

Bamyan Alt on other hand is case of questionable design. Ticket bleed should start only after capture of flag.

[WingWalker]

I don't like the ticket bleed, I feel like there should be some ability for hope on the last flag.

A team coming back after being beaten all the way to the fortress would be TOTAL EPIC PR.

I love long matches though.

Really long matches give time for multiple epic stories to take place.

I remember match ups like this, you would have total periods of time where different things would happen and thinking back on the match it was like everything different you did happened on a different day of the week, felt very epic.

But yeah, as Rhino said people on PR generally do not like longer run times on maps. I personally love a match that would go on for hours.

With MEC beaten to the Fortress, there is no spawn ability by the time the US is down there. Maybe if the MEC could spawn no matter how many US are in there, allowing for a fight to take place, with the ticket bleed so it doesn't go on forever.

The US still seems to have that chance though when beaten to the Docks since they can spawn on the carrier.

[[R-MOD]Nate.]

fyi please open a new thread if you want to discuss ticket bleed in general

[Nightingale]

I think this should be less one-sided, now it should be a lot harder for MEC to rush the flag. I know there is still the bottleneck at the I9 highway area. In my mind, BluFor would be able to use the I11 mountain to build TOWs/mortars and stuff to overlook the dockside. IDF should use this big mountain to their advantage.

Let me know what you think.

And please make a new thread if you don't plan on discussing Muttrah.

[Coalz101]

Originally Posted by Nightingale

3 Indestructible Namers vs Shilka and 3 BTRs. That's not balanced at all. The namer is equivalent to a BTR 82A in my opinion, maybe even BMP2 (No ATGM). Gazelle won't be much of a challenge, I imagine the pilots getting sniped out by 50 cal fire.

[WingWalker]

Just had a good round on Muttrah.

I don't think there is an imbalance generally unless the MEC is back to fortress.

The time before the U.S. got down to the fortress then it was no fighting becasue the MEC couldn't spawn.

This time the MEC fought the U.S. all the way back to North City and U.S held them there, but lost.

I still feel the MEC has no chance once beaten back to fortress, though the U.S. can always get to the Docks, or anywhere else in the city, from the carrier.

That is weird, since the map is supposedly the MECs home town with all their supplies, so they should have the advantage when it comes to spawning.

[Coalz101]

Originally Posted by WingWalker

That is weird, since the map is supposedly the MECs home town with all their supplies, so they should have the advantage when it comes to spawning.

Consider World War 2, D-Day landings, its obvious that even though its suppose to be their territory they still have to wait for supplies as its not a Main Military Depot for them. In other words if you lose the front you will fall back because you'll not be able to get reinforcements in time to save it.