Nade spam ruins .7 tactical infantry combat

[BloodBane611]

I totally disagree. You are not working well as a squad if you are being put away by grenades. Use spacing, plan your movements, don't get caught with your butt in the air. YOU should be using grenades, or some kind of explosive, when you are in a defensive position or an assaulting position. To not do so is just self limiting and obviously hurts your squads abilities.

Everyone should use spacing, everyone should be EXPECTING grenades. They are extremely effective against undisciplined troops unwilling to use proper spacing or work together. They are ineffective against troops who work together and remember spacing.

[Antonious_Bloc]

So far in 0.7, I've never been killed by a grenade. A new release just came out, and I'm on my Christmas break and my girlfriend is busy, so I'm playing quite a bit every day. The closest I've come is having them land near me, but by running away and behind something else, it just gives me a shock. It really doesn't seem like a problem.

Also, in real life, almost every soldier carries 4-5 grenades on them. As others have stated, it is realistic for a squad to frag a hostile place out before entering. If you cut back on the number of nades, then you are taking two hits to the reality department by reducing the realistic amount, and by discouraging real life tactics, which is part of the point of the mod.

And somebody is going to think that you need a really organized clan squad to be able to plan out spacing, which isn't really true. All I say whenever I'm leading my own squad is "alright guys, let's keep some space between us so we don't all get killed by a grenade", and my squadmates won't bunch up during the fight.

[joselucca]

nade spamming rules! its what they taught us in basic...enemy in bunker? undercover? around corner?....LOB A GRENADE!
oh, and Antonius is absolutely right.

[BabaGurGur]

I only nade spammed once and that was in .6, ins had the VCP, re-supply came from a rover parked outside, and I let the spam begin, got 32 kills

[Katarn]

I think the majority of the "nade spam" that Wolfe is experiencing is not from 20-30 meters away but from 50-75. In a real combat situation, a soldier or marine will most likely not be able to throw a grenade full distance; he'll be lobbing it OVER cover INTO cover - meaning he has to be about 25 meters away to achieve an accurate throw with the correct amount of force. I think an appropriate change (suggested by rico11b earlier) is to just decrease the amount of distance a frag grenade can be thrown. If that is done, I think we'll see a lot more care in the usage of frag grenades as the blast radius is drastically closer to the thrower and thus his teammates. Also if you stick your head out with a frag grenade and not a rifle at that range, you're toast anyway.

[Rico11b]

Originally Posted by BloodBane611

I totally disagree. You are not working well as a squad if you are being put away by grenades. Use spacing, plan your movements, don't get caught with your butt in the air. YOU should be using grenades, or some kind of explosive, when you are in a defensive position or an assaulting position. To not do so is just self limiting and obviously hurts your squads abilities.

Everyone should use spacing, everyone should be EXPECTING grenades. They are extremely effective against undisciplined troops unwilling to use proper spacing or work together. They are ineffective against troops who work together and remember spacing.

You were making a silly assumption, then so will I.
If you haven't been "put away by grenades" yourself, then you must be playing against single player bots. Human players in multiplayer are MUCH more sneaky and crafty than a stupid bot. And they CAN get in close enough (50+meters) to nade the hell out of your position. Especially on maps that provide lots and lots of cover to protect from small arms fire. Most anything in game except fences and destroyable building will stop even 7.62 rounds so cover is very easy to stumble across in game. Unless you are on some wide open map like Kashan.

Further more a hand grenade doesn't care how "disciplined" you are or how well you work as a team. It will still blow your butt to smitherines.
Kinda hard to keep the other team out of nade range when the rifles are not uber accurate anymore (which is a really great thing) and almost everything in game stops bullets (ie. no penetration). The biggest reason is that players will still stand right up and throw nades 50+ meters while bullets are pouring in all over there position. The sad thing is that those knuckleheads end up with the kills when they should be getting owned for doing such a stupid thing.

Bullet penetration is the next "BIG" thing that needs to be addressed in game. As I've said before. Nade throwing distances are a bit to long. Don't believe, then go find a rock or something that is just as heavy as a nade and trying throwing it while lying in prone and crouched. (Can't remember how heavy a nade is, if I did I would post it.) Lying in the prone I'll bet you can't toss that rock 50+ meters can you, but you can do it in game. I've seen players do it. You can't throw a nade as far as a baseball, cause it's a good bit heavier, plus it won't roll the same cause of the fuse assembly sticking out. There are lots of guys that can throw a nade that far on the training range, but most guys can't. It's only the superstars that can do it, but not while bullets are pouring in on position.
I've watched a player jump/toss a nade at least 50 to 60 meters while a saw gunner and other rifleman where trying to hit him. They did get him but only after he threw the nade and took out about 5 or 6 other players from a different squad. The "discipline" you speak of kinda looses out in the face to dumb crap like that, but I see it in game all the time.
But since the only fear in game is waiting 30+ seconds to respawn I guess it's an issue we all have to put up with. There's really no way to get or make players play with self preservation in mind is there?

R

[Rico11b]

Since everyone around here seems to worship Wikipedia. Here ya go. Take notice of what is said about distance. Remember the guys with the "gifted arm" (aka Superstars) can throw a little bit farther. But they are few and far between. And who the hell is gonna take the time to stand up and get a proper stand to throw a nade max distance when all hell is breaking loose around them?

You wanna be INFANTRY, then you gotta be a lover of cover!!!

Now without further ...



M67 FRAGMENTATION HAND GRENADE

The body of the M-67 hand grenade is a 2.5-inch diameter steel sphere designed to burst into numerous fragments when detonated. It produces casualties within an effective range of 49.5 feet (15 meters) by the high velocity projection of fragments. The grenade body contains 6.5 ounces of high explosive. Each grenade is fitted with a fuse that activates the explosive charge.

(1) Body -- steel sphere.

(2) Filler -- 6.5 ounces of Composition B.

(3) Fuze -- M213.

(4) Weight -- 14 ounces.

(5) Safety clip -- yes.

(6) Capabilities -- can be thrown 40 meters by average soldier. The effective casualty-producing radius is 15 meters. ALTHOUGH THE KILLING RADIUS IS 5 METERS AND THE CASUALTY PRODUCING RADIUS OF THIS GRENADE IS 15 METERS, FRAGMENTS CAN DISPERSE AS FAR AWAY AS 230 METERS.

(7) Color/markings -- olive drab body with a single yellow band at the top. Nomenclature and or lot number markings are in yellow.



Still think a baseball and a nade are the same thing? Here ya go. Right from good ole Wiki again:

A baseball is a ball used primarily in the sport of the same name, baseball. It is generally between 9 inches (22.9 cm) and 9¼ inches (23.5 cm) in circumference, and 5 ounces avoirdupois (142 g) in weight, though sometimes different-size balls may be used in children's leagues.

[BabaGurGur]

i think rico just told me a baseball is 23cm wide or long o.O

[Rico11b]

Originally Posted by BabaGurGur

i think rico just told me a baseball is 23cm wide or long o.O

Read it again, it says "9¼ inches (23.5 cm) in circumference.

[blud]

I'd like to see the game evolve not by removing things that get you killed. You've already removed weapon accuracy, and before that TG's server had removed via rules a bunch of other tactics that got them killed. Once you have nerfed the nades, you will start getting killed by another tactic and come on here saying how that tactic needs to be removed too. If you didn't want nade spamming to be so relatively effective compared to actually shooting guns, then you shouldn't have pushed ruining the accuracy of the guns.