Italian army - Page 3

MikeDude · 2015-06-26, 09:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by simeon5541

You Italians should get together and put some work in,look how Frenchies made it to the final,
if I remember correctly,they even didn't knew how to mod when started their project.

And the Polish are close as well!

BSR_Pheelz · 2015-06-29, 10:36

...Well...the Italian faction in PR is an idea that is around for years now, and as we can see from the posts here, both the Italian PR "community" (as we can call it...less than 20/30 active players...) and the DEVs are not so willing to put in practice; the community for a lack of knowledge about mapping/modelling/cinematic, and DEVs team because the implementation of faction is not so easy or simply "because no".

Speaking in terms feasibility the Italian faction is definetely the most easy to make, instead of Japan and Taiwan or the Indian army; this because basically a great part of the ITA army's equipment is already in PR and, as Ploddit said, having a new faction with some new gear will add diversity to the factions and maybe attract some fresh players "cuz hurr durr I can play with my own national army" (and probably went like this for Dutchies, Frenchies and the soon to be Polish, but if we look close and put apart real life mission of these army, we still get brand new rifles as Famas, veichles like VAB and Leclerq, Fennec for Dutch... and so on )

If we start thinking (and this goes to the italian guys albertofum and Difenucci) what you should really need for make the faction, here is a list of possible veichles and equipment:

Extrema Ratio Fulcrum (bayonet/knife) - need to be created or placeholder
Beretta 92FS - already in PR
Beretta PM12 (crewman) - need to be created or placeholder (MP5)
Beretta AR 70/90 - SC 70/90 - SCP 70/90 need to be created / Beretta ARX 160 - since 2010 is replacing 70/90
Franchi Spas 15 - (Breacher), if you wanna go out with style, put Spas 12
FN Minimi - (Automatic Rifleman) - already in PR
MG 42/59 - (Heavy Gunner) - already in PR
H&K MSG-90 / SR-25 / M110 - (Marksman) - first already in PR, the other 2 also or similar rifles
Sako TRG-42 / Accuracy International AW - (Sniper) - first maybe FIN community has already something, 2nd already in PR
M203 / GLX-160 - (Grenade Launcher) - first already in PR, 2nd to be created as long as ARX
OD82/SE - (Hand Grenade) - need to be created or use GER ones as placeholder (they look similar)
Panzerfaust3 - (Light AT) - already in PR GER faction / LAW as alternative
Milan - (Heavy AT) - already in PR FR faction
FIM-92 Stinger - (Manpad) - already in PR
TOW - already in PR
Browning .50 cal - already in PR
Aimpoint CompM2 (M68 CCO) / ACOG (Optics) - already in PR, at least ACOG
Sistema Compositi SEPT-2 - (Helmet) - need to be created / maybe FR as placeholder, they look similar

Vehicles:
Dardo (IFV) - need to be created
VCC-1 "Camillino" (APC)- need to be created / M113 - already in PR / AAV7 RAM - already in PR
C1 - C2-Mk2 "Ariete" / Leopard 1 - (MBT) - need to be created, both / Leopard 2 from GER as placeholder
SIDAM 25 - (Mobile AA) - could be possible, it's an m113 with AA turret / OTOMATIC - need to be created
Iveco VTLM "Lince" - (CLV) - already in PR as UK "Panther"
Land Rover Defender AR90 - (JP) - already in PR UK faction w/without .50 cal ( I think ITA use "Kurtz" too) / Iveco VM90 - need to be created, but also used by Polish forces, maybe they have something already (?)
Iveco ACM 80/90 - Lancia ACL 90 / Autocarro Tattico Leggero 4X4 - (transp) - need to be created (choose one) or US as placeholder.
A129 "Mangusta" - Attack Chopper - need to be created / CHI one as placeholder
AB 412 - Transp Chopper - already in PR
NH90 - Transp Chopper - already in PR
CH-47C "Chinook" - Transp Chopper - already in PR
EF2000 "Typhoon" - Fighters - already in PR
Panavia Tornado IDS/ECR - already in PR
F35 A/B - already in PR

this could be a possible list of assets and gears, some of them are already in PR, others could be used as placeholder using existing assets/gears, and others need to be created from scratch. this list should follow the maps (I guess at least one new map, probably INS one or Middle East theme or Balcans theme...) others maps could be used as placeholders (thinking Fallujah, Karbala, Kozelsk, Iron Ridge, Dragonfly, Ramiel specially, cuz Somalia...). Some assets also could be omitted, like AAs or MBT. The Italian faction could be "spend" in a lot of layout and maps, both new and old.

I don't know which are the requirement for a new faction in PR, on the DEVs side (...minimun numbers of maps, numbers of new assets and so on...) and again, the base condition for having the Italian faction, is that both the ITA modders and the DEVs must be motivated to put it in practice. If one of the two going to miss, this faction and a lot of others will never be created.

Cheers.

Pheelz

[R-DEV]camo · 2015-06-29, 13:01

It's not up to the devs to "be motivated" to create a faction. It's up to the community faction team. With that said devs will often help out to finish a faction.

As for the Italian faction being the easiest to complete I disagree. There's an aweful lot of content there that needs to be created from scratch. Almost every ground vehicle needs to be made, not an easy task by any stretch of the imagination.
Then there's the fact there are zero maps, you need a minimum of 4 good quality maps for a faction to be considered although one or two current maps could be used as placeholders as other factions seem to do that too.
Lastly there are lots of factions that could be considered "easy" due to them using equipment that is already in-game, Denmark, NZ and AU for example just quickly come to mind. But with all that said I'd still love to play as the Italians in pr one day, however unlikely it may be.

Cossack · 2015-06-29, 16:03

Indeed, that is a big list that has to be done. DEV's can only help get things fixed and polished, but that's about it.

Want Italians in game, start working on that list.

BSR_Pheelz · 2015-06-29, 21:53

@Camo
with "motivated" I wasn't meaning that the DEVs have to literally beg community members for start creating a faction, as you said, it's not up to them. What I was trying to say (and i apologize for my english, sure I lack some nuances and semantics, so please correct me and ask me to re-elaborate if I sound not clear or too rude, I will take no offence) is that whenever there could be an appeal in any new faction, in this case the Italian one, and some people interested to get involved in the creation process, having negative answers I think is not the best way to attract people and commit them. That's why I used the term "motivated" referred for both side, DEVs and community.
In my own opinion an answer like Turista's one is the best option possible, clear, simple, kinda "professional" I dare to say.

I disagree about the fact that almost every ground vehicle need to be created from zero, in the list the bold red means that none of these are already in any faction in PR, AFAIK, so only an IFV, an APC (or even not this one, since ITA army uses the other 2, VCC-1 cuz the entire game will gain a new asset) an MBT (could be omitted on the base of a new map without heavy asset, the same for mobile AA, as the GER and FR faction does not have one, I guess it's not mandatory creating one...) a Truck and an Attack chopper.
So in total are 4 veichles, 3 or 2 if you don't count the VCC and C-1 / C-2 MBT, on a list of 13 veichles (not counting mobile AA, it will 14 with it).
As I remember right the minimum map needed is 2 good map, not 4 (looking at NL and FR faction as you said), and other 2 could be used for placeholders, but 4 seems not to be the rule (last time I saw in PR 4 new map for a faction was for IDF).

Ofc stays the fact that all the soldier's uniforms and equipments need to be made, this goes byitself.

With all that said, you all are right saying that is the community that first need to start this faction, and I posted the list and answered here more for the newcomers than for VETs and DEVs, hoping that among them could be some interested in this, and maybe, if they have skills, in a future, they could count on DEVs help for the last polishing or fixing.
Btw, Camo, I would like to play with ADF one day, love that uniforms pattern, however unlikely it may be.

Cossack · 2015-06-30, 09:00

Another thing is, faction must live up to PR standarts. And those are defined by DEV team. It is a matter of quality.

[R-DEV]UTurista · 2015-06-30, 17:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by BSR_Pheelz

... I posted the list and answered here more for the newcomers than for VETs and DEVs, hoping that among them could be some interested in this, and maybe, if they have skills, in a future, they could count on DEVs help for the last polishing or fixing...

I don't care the faction, if it is up the standards the more the better.

With that said and if you're really intereste in creating the Italian faction I recommend you to read Rhino's post in How to start a faction, link. It can be resumed in 3 things:

Make a proper plan - The more complete your plan is, the more likeness of attracting other people to help
Assemble a team - Unless you're a really skilled developer making a faction on your own its not really feasible
Submit everything (Plan + Team) to Red Tags - Once approved, the Leader of the Community mod will get access to the R-COM (Faction) forums so he can be in direct contact with CONs & DEVs

Furthermore, if you want to start with project I would make a new thread with all the planing made.

Edit: Expanding with some examples:
Polish Forces - Design Plan
Polish Forces - PR Highlight
Ukraine Forces - Thread
Finnish Defence forces - Design Plan

Again I'll end by saying its not an easy task

Forgotten · 2015-06-30, 19:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by BSR_Pheelz

...Well...the Italian faction in PR is an idea that is around for years now, and as we can see from the posts here, both the Italian PR "community" (as we can call it...less than 20/30 active players...) and the DEVs are not so willing to put in practice; the community for a lack of knowledge about mapping/modelling/cinematic, and DEVs team because the implementation of faction is not so easy or simply "because no".

Speaking in terms feasibility the Italian faction is definetely the most easy to make, instead of Japan and Taiwan or the Indian army; this because basically a great part of the ITA army's equipment is already in PR and, as Ploddit said, having a new faction with some new gear will add diversity to the factions and maybe attract some fresh players "cuz hurr durr I can play with my own national army" (and probably went like this for Dutchies, Frenchies and the soon to be Polish, but if we look close and put apart real life mission of these army, we still get brand new rifles as Famas, veichles like VAB and Leclerq, Fennec for Dutch... and so on )

If we start thinking (and this goes to the italian guys albertofum and Difenucci) what you should really need for make the faction, here is a list of possible veichles and equipment:

Extrema Ratio Fulcrum (bayonet/knife) - need to be created or placeholder
Beretta 92FS - already in PR
Beretta PM12 (crewman) - need to be created or placeholder (MP5)
Beretta AR 70/90 - SC 70/90 - SCP 70/90 need to be created / Beretta ARX 160 - since 2010 is replacing 70/90
Franchi Spas 15 - (Breacher), if you wanna go out with style, put Spas 12
FN Minimi - (Automatic Rifleman) - already in PR
MG 42/59 - (Heavy Gunner) - already in PR
H&K MSG-90 / SR-25 / M110 - (Marksman) - first already in PR, the other 2 also or similar rifles
Sako TRG-42 / Accuracy International AW - (Sniper) - first maybe FIN community has already something, 2nd already in PR
M203 / GLX-160 - (Grenade Launcher) - first already in PR, 2nd to be created as long as ARX
OD82/SE - (Hand Grenade) - need to be created or use GER ones as placeholder (they look similar)
Panzerfaust3 - (Light AT) - already in PR GER faction / LAW as alternative
Milan - (Heavy AT) - already in PR FR faction
FIM-92 Stinger - (Manpad) - already in PR
TOW - already in PR
Browning .50 cal - already in PR
Aimpoint CompM2 (M68 CCO) / ACOG (Optics) - already in PR, at least ACOG
Sistema Compositi SEPT-2 - (Helmet) - need to be created / maybe FR as placeholder, they look similar

Vehicles:
Dardo (IFV) - need to be created
VCC-1 "Camillino" (APC)- need to be created / M113 - already in PR / AAV7 RAM - already in PR
C1 - C2-Mk2 "Ariete" / Leopard 1 - (MBT) - need to be created, both / Leopard 2 from GER as placeholder
SIDAM 25 - (Mobile AA) - could be possible, it's an m113 with AA turret / OTOMATIC - need to be created
Iveco VTLM "Lince" - (CLV) - already in PR as UK "Panther"
Land Rover Defender AR90 - (JP) - already in PR UK faction w/without .50 cal ( I think ITA use "Kurtz" too) / Iveco VM90 - need to be created, but also used by Polish forces, maybe they have something already (?)
Iveco ACM 80/90 - Lancia ACL 90 / Autocarro Tattico Leggero 4X4 - (transp) - need to be created (choose one) or US as placeholder.
A129 "Mangusta" - Attack Chopper - need to be created / CHI one as placeholder
AB 412 - Transp Chopper - already in PR
NH90 - Transp Chopper - already in PR
CH-47C "Chinook" - Transp Chopper - already in PR
EF2000 "Typhoon" - Fighters - already in PR
Panavia Tornado IDS/ECR - already in PR
F35 A/B - already in PR

this could be a possible list of assets and gears, some of them are already in PR, others could be used as placeholder using existing assets/gears, and others need to be created from scratch. this list should follow the maps (I guess at least one new map, probably INS one or Middle East theme or Balcans theme...) others maps could be used as placeholders (thinking Fallujah, Karbala, Kozelsk, Iron Ridge, Dragonfly, Ramiel specially, cuz Somalia...). Some assets also could be omitted, like AAs or MBT. The Italian faction could be "spend" in a lot of layout and maps, both new and old.

I don't know which are the requirement for a new faction in PR, on the DEVs side (...minimun numbers of maps, numbers of new assets and so on...) and again, the base condition for having the Italian faction, is that both the ITA modders and the DEVs must be motivated to put it in practice. If one of the two going to miss, this faction and a lot of others will never be created.

Cheers.

Pheelz

Nah, Polish Army is using VM 90 only as ambulance, also it is not planned for PF I think.

sweedensniiperr · 2015-07-03, 08:20

That's a good list for a start but you forgot:

Animations, a map, kit geometries and soldier skins.

BSR_Pheelz · 2015-07-03, 09:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by BSR_Pheelz

... Ofc stays the fact that all the soldier's uniforms and equipments need to be made, this goes byitself.....

...meant that Alex ... forgot the animations, of course all these things goes byitself ...

2015-06-29, 10:36	#22
BSR_Pheelz Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 13 Italy	Re: Italian army ...Well...the Italian faction in PR is an idea that is around for years now, and as we can see from the posts here, both the Italian PR "community" (as we can call it...less than 20/30 active players...) and the DEVs are not so willing to put in practice; the community for a lack of knowledge about mapping/modelling/cinematic, and DEVs team because the implementation of faction is not so easy or simply "because no". Speaking in terms feasibility the Italian faction is definetely the most easy to make, instead of Japan and Taiwan or the Indian army; this because basically a great part of the ITA army's equipment is already in PR and, as Ploddit said, having a new faction with some new gear will add diversity to the factions and maybe attract some fresh players "cuz hurr durr I can play with my own national army" (and probably went like this for Dutchies, Frenchies and the soon to be Polish, but if we look close and put apart real life mission of these army, we still get brand new rifles as Famas, veichles like VAB and Leclerq, Fennec for Dutch... and so on ) If we start thinking (and this goes to the italian guys albertofum and Difenucci) what you should really need for make the faction, here is a list of possible veichles and equipment: Extrema Ratio Fulcrum (bayonet/knife) - need to be created or placeholder Beretta 92FS - already in PR Beretta PM12 (crewman) - need to be created or placeholder (MP5) Beretta AR 70/90 - SC 70/90 - SCP 70/90 need to be created / Beretta ARX 160 - since 2010 is replacing 70/90 Franchi Spas 15 - (Breacher), if you wanna go out with style, put Spas 12 FN Minimi - (Automatic Rifleman) - already in PR MG 42/59 - (Heavy Gunner) - already in PR H&K MSG-90 / SR-25 / M110 - (Marksman) - first already in PR, the other 2 also or similar rifles Sako TRG-42 / Accuracy International AW - (Sniper) - first maybe FIN community has already something, 2nd already in PR M203 / GLX-160 - (Grenade Launcher) - first already in PR, 2nd to be created as long as ARX OD82/SE - (Hand Grenade) - need to be created or use GER ones as placeholder (they look similar) Panzerfaust3 - (Light AT) - already in PR GER faction / LAW as alternative Milan - (Heavy AT) - already in PR FR faction FIM-92 Stinger - (Manpad) - already in PR TOW - already in PR Browning .50 cal - already in PR Aimpoint CompM2 (M68 CCO) / ACOG (Optics) - already in PR, at least ACOG Sistema Compositi SEPT-2 - (Helmet) - need to be created / maybe FR as placeholder, they look similar Vehicles: Dardo (IFV) - need to be created VCC-1 "Camillino" (APC)- need to be created / M113 - already in PR / AAV7 RAM - already in PR C1 - C2-Mk2 "Ariete" / Leopard 1 - (MBT) - need to be created, both / Leopard 2 from GER as placeholder SIDAM 25 - (Mobile AA) - could be possible, it's an m113 with AA turret / OTOMATIC - need to be created Iveco VTLM "Lince" - (CLV) - already in PR as UK "Panther" Land Rover Defender AR90 - (JP) - already in PR UK faction w/without .50 cal ( I think ITA use "Kurtz" too) / Iveco VM90 - need to be created, but also used by Polish forces, maybe they have something already (?) Iveco ACM 80/90 - Lancia ACL 90 / Autocarro Tattico Leggero 4X4 - (transp) - need to be created (choose one) or US as placeholder. A129 "Mangusta" - Attack Chopper - need to be created / CHI one as placeholder AB 412 - Transp Chopper - already in PR NH90 - Transp Chopper - already in PR CH-47C "Chinook" - Transp Chopper - already in PR EF2000 "Typhoon" - Fighters - already in PR Panavia Tornado IDS/ECR - already in PR F35 A/B - already in PR this could be a possible list of assets and gears, some of them are already in PR, others could be used as placeholder using existing assets/gears, and others need to be created from scratch. this list should follow the maps (I guess at least one new map, probably INS one or Middle East theme or Balcans theme...) others maps could be used as placeholders (thinking Fallujah, Karbala, Kozelsk, Iron Ridge, Dragonfly, Ramiel specially, cuz Somalia...). Some assets also could be omitted, like AAs or MBT. The Italian faction could be "spend" in a lot of layout and maps, both new and old. I don't know which are the requirement for a new faction in PR, on the DEVs side (...minimun numbers of maps, numbers of new assets and so on...) and again, the base condition for having the Italian faction, is that both the ITA modders and the DEVs must be motivated to put it in practice. If one of the two going to miss, this faction and a lot of others will never be created. Cheers. Pheelz
BSR_Pheelz Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 13 Italy

2015-06-29, 16:03	#24
Cossack Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,681 Latvia Location: Riga	Re: Italian army Indeed, that is a big list that has to be done. DEV's can only help get things fixed and polished, but that's about it. Want Italians in game, start working on that list.

2015-06-29, 21:53	#25
BSR_Pheelz Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 13 Italy	Re: Italian army @Camo with "motivated" I wasn't meaning that the DEVs have to literally beg community members for start creating a faction, as you said, it's not up to them. What I was trying to say (and i apologize for my english, sure I lack some nuances and semantics, so please correct me and ask me to re-elaborate if I sound not clear or too rude, I will take no offence) is that whenever there could be an appeal in any new faction, in this case the Italian one, and some people interested to get involved in the creation process, having negative answers I think is not the best way to attract people and commit them. That's why I used the term "motivated" referred for both side, DEVs and community. In my own opinion an answer like Turista's one is the best option possible, clear, simple, kinda "professional" I dare to say. I disagree about the fact that almost every ground vehicle need to be created from zero, in the list the bold red means that none of these are already in any faction in PR, AFAIK, so only an IFV, an APC (or even not this one, since ITA army uses the other 2, VCC-1 cuz the entire game will gain a new asset) an MBT (could be omitted on the base of a new map without heavy asset, the same for mobile AA, as the GER and FR faction does not have one, I guess it's not mandatory creating one...) a Truck and an Attack chopper. So in total are 4 veichles, 3 or 2 if you don't count the VCC and C-1 / C-2 MBT, on a list of 13 veichles (not counting mobile AA, it will 14 with it). As I remember right the minimum map needed is 2 good map, not 4 (looking at NL and FR faction as you said), and other 2 could be used for placeholders, but 4 seems not to be the rule (last time I saw in PR 4 new map for a faction was for IDF). Ofc stays the fact that all the soldier's uniforms and equipments need to be made, this goes byitself. With all that said, you all are right saying that is the community that first need to start this faction, and I posted the list and answered here more for the newcomers than for VETs and DEVs, hoping that among them could be some interested in this, and maybe, if they have skills, in a future, they could count on DEVs help for the last polishing or fixing. Btw, Camo, I would like to play with ADF one day, love that uniforms pattern, however unlikely it may be.
BSR_Pheelz Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 13 Italy

2015-06-30, 09:00	#26
Cossack Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,681 Latvia Location: Riga	Re: Italian army Another thing is, faction must live up to PR standarts. And those are defined by DEV team. It is a matter of quality.

2015-07-03, 08:20	#29
sweedensniiperr Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 2,749 Sweden	Re: Italian army That's a good list for a start but you forgot: Animations, a map, kit geometries and soldier skins.
sweedensniiperr Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 2,749 Sweden

2015-06-29, 13:01	#23
[R-DEV]camo PR:BF2 Developer Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 3,087 Australia	It's not up to the devs to "be motivated" to create a faction. It's up to the community faction team. With that said devs will often help out to finish a faction. As for the Italian faction being the easiest to complete I disagree. There's an aweful lot of content there that needs to be created from scratch. Almost every ground vehicle needs to be made, not an easy task by any stretch of the imagination. Then there's the fact there are zero maps, you need a minimum of 4 good quality maps for a faction to be considered although one or two current maps could be used as placeholders as other factions seem to do that too. Lastly there are lots of factions that could be considered "easy" due to them using equipment that is already in-game, Denmark, NZ and AU for example just quickly come to mind. But with all that said I'd still love to play as the Italians in pr one day, however unlikely it may be.