What went "wrong" with PR 0.7

[VipersGhost]

Originally Posted by Jonny

I made Kashan into the best infantry map I have ever seen. Assets were used strategically and vehicles used for transport and fire support a hell of a lot. Some of the best moments in PR have been playing something in an infantry way of thinking, be it multiple tanks, LCM Kashan or hunting armour on Qwai with a TOW. Quick movement, player based and placed objectives and flanking are the best parts.

I like the sound of this^^.

Some good out of the box map options from Jonny. Pretty soon these guys (jonny, mosquil zaboo etc) will have the ballistics fixed too. All good stuff to keep PR fresh.

[Rico11b]

Originally Posted by [R-DEV]Rhino

lol, qinling, kashan and kufrah are not infantry maps, hence why they have soo many assets.

Well what are they then, because they aren't Armor maps either. There isn't enough armor on the maps to be an armor map, and not enough Infantry to have infantry support, so it must be some sort of hybrid. There is only 32 players per side, so just how can you pull off a hybrid map and please the masses? Especially a map the size of Kashan. Now if we could get 64 players per side that would be another matter, but I know that's not possible. But just how could you make a Hybrid map work out well and still be super sized with only 32 players per side? answer that, and you will be on to something

[Eddiereyes909]

In all honesty, i agree with Rhino.

I havnt played PR with my clan in a while now because i have a crappy PC. where before i could stand to play a great game of kashan on all low and crappy fraps, i feel its just not worth it anymore. IMO, im waiting for the patch to play again, or until my new parts come in, which ever's better.

[VipersGhost]

A hybrid map can be large to allow for realistic asset play but it also very much so needs to herd the infantry into conflict. The map design through whatever elements are available need to focus the action naturally that way the other half of the team thats not in a tank/plane will have good consistent action. Allow for more structures in a linear fashion. Get rid of the fish bowl flags that do nothing but promote tanks siting like eagles on a ridge. There are definitely things that can be done to make the action/conflict more focused, consistent and fun.

[Rhino]

Originally Posted by Rico11b

Well what are they then, because they aren't Armor maps either. There isn't enough armor on the maps to be an armor map, and not enough Infantry to have infantry support, so it must be some sort of hybrid. There is only 32 players per side, so just how can you pull off a hybrid map and please the masses? Especially a map the size of Kashan. Now if we could get 64 players per side that would be another matter, but I know that's not possible. But just how could you make a Hybrid map work out well and still be super sized with only 32 players per side? answer that, and you will be on to something

Qinling and kashan are really "combined arms" maps, which means they are mainly asset based. For the tanks, choppers, jets etc to be really effective they do need afew troops on the ground. Best Qinling game I've had was the TG vs PR Clans game not long back, where we had the ABA clan doing all the recon for all the other squads and it worked soo damn well, with also a mech infantry squad, 2 tank squads, a chopper squad and a jet squad worked really well all together coridnated by the commander etc. Thou our side was low on nubmers we still had a really good game and shows how the map needs to be played out really which UK_Force said after it was the most realistic game he had played as to how the assets where used in it, and he has stated many times that in thous sorts of battles there would not be many infantry in them.

Yes it would be nice to have more players on the map, but engine limitations so that is the best we can do with it, its much much better than just having only infantry and mech infantry maps though out the mod

[Artnez[US]]

It's all about the squad leaders. If they move right, put up rally points in the right places and keep their squad mates in check, everything will go nice and smooth.

For me gameplay has been just as good as it was before, nothing has changed.

[Rhino]

Originally Posted by Artnez[US]

It's all about the squad leaders. If they move right, put up rally points in the right places and keep their squad mates in check, everything will go nice and smooth.

For me gameplay has been just as good as it was before, nothing has changed.

thats what fuzzhead kept on saying to me, but when I was in his squad I still found the same problems I had when playing with most other people....

[VipersGhost]

Originally Posted by [R-DEV]Rhino

Qinling and kashan are really "combined arms" maps, which means they are mainly asset based. For the tanks, choppers, jets etc to be really effective they do need afew troops on the ground. Best Qinling game I've had was the TG vs PR Clans game not long back, where we had the ABA clan doing all the recon for all the other squads and it worked soo damn well, with also a mech infantry squad, 2 tank squads, a chopper squad and a jet squad worked really well all together coridnated by the commander etc. Thou our side was low on nubmers we still had a really good game and shows how the map needs to be played out really which UK_Force said after it was the most realistic game he had played as to how the assets where used in it, and he has stated many times that in thous sorts of battles there would not be many infantry in them.

I understand the combined arms thing but lets do the math.

4 tanks x 2 players = 8
1 AH x2 players = 2
2 transports = 2
1 APC = 2
2 Jets = 2

Assuming a PERFECT round with all working assets (not some dead and waiting 20mins). That equals 16 guys in use of FULL ASSETS. So what the heck is the other HALF of the team is supposed to do? Recon/Skirmish/TankFodder for 1-2 hours? You cannot just dismiss the map playing poorly because its a combined arms map. I really think there is more opportunity here for fun for the rest of the team not in an asset. No need to be stubborn about it, lets throw some ideas around and see what works...

[Rhino]

Originally Posted by VipersGhost

I understand the combined arms thing but lets do the math.

4 tanks x 2 players = 8
1 AH x2 players = 2
2 transports = 2
1 APC = 2
2 Jets = 2

Assuming a PERFECT round with all working assets (not some dead and waiting 20mins). That equals 16 guys in use of FULL ASSETS. So what the heck is the other HALF of the team is supposed to do? Recon/Skirmish/TankFodder for 1-2 hours? You cannot just dismiss the map playing poorly because its a combined arms map. I really think there is more opportunity here for fun for the rest of the team not in an asset. No need to be stubborn about it, lets throw some ideas around and see what works...

na, you have missed out afew things and got some of the numbers wrong

2 Jets = 2 player
1 AH x2 pilots = 2 players
1 transports chopper x 1 pilot + 1 squad = 7 players
4 tanks x 2 crewman = 8 players
1 AAV x 1 crewman = 1 player
1 APC x 2 crewman + 1 Squad = 8 players

All in all, thats a total of 28 players and the rest of the 4 players left can be the commander and recon aswell as the chopper based squad will for the most of the time be on foot, with only being inserted and extracted from time to time but the most effective use of the chopper is to insert and xtract recon teams.

[Cyrax-Sektor]

The removal of SL-spawning would be a good idea, if all SLs and SMs worked together and actively placed RPs. Occasionally, I'll play with a good SL, but then some of the SMs don't go with the SL. Today, Sparkks got so ticked he left the game after getting ambushed waiting for another SM, a sniper in our squad being rather close.

Many times, I've been in squads that had a rally near the lake in Qinling 32, and even after moving forward with his squad and an officer kit, he didn't set a new rally. Long walks. And the British had their RPs set up in the mountains overseeing coal mine to the East, always ready to dive in the action after dying.