Lower Accuracy

[bunny]

i suppose one could go either way on this. On one hand, yes, lower accuracy would make for stuningly realistic shootouts, but on the other, i assure you that every little 10 year old playing this mod will be screaming every time they miss =, even when its not due to the gun's accuracy, and begin cursing the coders and start putting up posts here to make the guns more accurate, thus creating a never ending struggle between the two until a compromise is reached

[Rico11b]

Originally Posted by Harrelson

This mod is being influenced by people who likes instant killing. THIS IS NOT REALITY.

My honest opinion of 0.6, infantry maps are not fun at all. Maybe Basra is an exception when playing as insurgent because you play like a twat without any plan and just try to have fun

Remove the scopes and tweak accuracy is my suggestion.

Look at videos of grunts in Iraq fighting. They DONT wait to see someone so they can shoot, they use supressing fire and lots of it. Thats why is seems like they are shooting at nothing.

Unfortunately, this mod emphasizes the opposite, wait till you see someone and put your crosshairs on his head, squeeze and hes dead. This happens to you and to them, vice versa the whole round. Kills and deaths are in the hundreds on each side. Oh no!

In vietnam, 500,000 bullets was what a grunt used to kill 1 enemy soldier. In modern day iraq, its around 40,000 bullets used per enemy dead. In PR, 2 bullets is whats needed per enemy dead.

Its too easy to kill in this game. Im not saying nerf the weapons or accuracy but make it less easy to identify and shoot people. Zoom in with you g3 scope and you can tell if its an enemy without even looking at the map.

Lastly, headshots never happen in real battles.
Headshots only occur when snipers shoot someone, but general firefights, Never.

p.s anyone remember .4 in falluja when enemies were in the opposing ridge (at the gates) and we would trade heavy gunfire for several minutes till one side got overwhelmed? that is my best memory of PR

I agree with ya on this. Thanks for posting those number concerning bullets used per kill. I couldn't remember the numbers on that, but it ties into the same thing I was saying earlier about this in post #50. It's accuracy through volume. Not one shot one kill for every one on the map.

[WNxKenwayy]

The reason we shoot so many bullets to kill a single target, is because in real life, bullets go through a paper thin wall. In PR, not so much. That's why no one uses suppressive fire.

[Rico11b]

Originally Posted by WNxKenwayy

The reason we shoot so many bullets to kill a single target, is because in real life, bullets go through a paper thin wall. In PR, not so much. That's why no one uses suppressive fire.

That's another point I was gonna bring up, but then I said to myself. Self, forget about it, they won't listen anyway It reminds my of something my brother used to say. "Don't teach a pig to sing, it wastes your time and annoys the pig." hehehe... Those words kinda ring true right now

Later
R

[Ghostrider]

Originally Posted by Longbow*

Gotta agree . Even in vanilla there is more competition in firefights , random deviation and such ... PR guns are too accurate , every prone shot hits . Thats unrealistic ...

Yeah, gotta agree. Gun designers focus on delivering inaccurate weapons, after all, I'm sure soldiers like the idea of having less accurate weapons to have longer firefights. That's pretty realistic

We really appreciate all the professional advice we get from almost everyone in the forums, but we're inclined to believe our military advisors and others within the team that have actually fired these types of guns irl.


-Ghost

[bosco_]

but i has watched black hawk down 10 times dosent taht make me n xpert????!?!

[VipersGhost]

I've had plenty of hunting rifles zero'd at 300yds. We would take a very very nice rest on some sandbags or bipod etc...even then at 300 yds you are still not PERFECTLY accurate...there is always some deviation. The bullet doesn't just go perfectly to where you put your cross hairs, it produces a pattern that you want to be fairly tight. I think we should have some deviation in PR(not for snipers though) but only a very minimal amount, maybe its already in there...who knows. So maybe anything past 200yds you will start to see a very slight deviation...so your bullets will fit in a 6-3 inch radius of a pattern..maybe less, I don't know what the real life MOA (minute of angle) stats should be for M16, think its about 3 which translates into about 3 inches of possible deviation at about 100 yds? Adding in this realistic deviation would reduce the laser-head shots from assualt rifles at such long ranges and produce a realistic effect.

So at 200 yds the M16 should have a possible deviation of 6 inches. Remeber 200yds is a decent shot.

To understand MOA we say if a gun has an MOA of 1...then at 100yds its 1inch deviation...at 200 2 inches...300 3 inches.

So to summerize deviation is dependant on the gun itself as well as the shooter. PR shooters are perfectly skilled due to weapon sway= hardcoded. I believe we should look into including the real world weapon MOA's at some point as it might make things a little more interesting...especially with all of the scopes out there now.

[Rico11b]

Originally Posted by [R-PUB]bosco

but i has watched black hawk down 10 times dosent taht make me n xpert????!?!

Nope, you are 5 short, and you must eat popcorn out of your helmet while watching it. You must also put a big red X on your screen and each time a bad guys head is under the X you must jump to your feet and scream boom, boom, boom! Hehehe lol

[Rico11b]

Originally Posted by VipersGhost

I've had plenty of hunting rifles zero'd at 300yds. We would take a very very nice rest on some sandbags or bipod etc...even then at 300 yds you are still not PERFECTLY accurate...there is always some deviation. The bullet doesn't just go perfectly to where you put your cross hairs, it produces a pattern that you want to be fairly tight. I think we should have some deviation in PR(not for snipers though) but only a very minimal amount, maybe its already in there...who knows. So maybe anything past 200yds you will start to see a very slight deviation...so your bullets will fit in a 6 inch radius..maybe less, I don't know what the RL MOA stats should be for M16. That would reduce the laser-head shots from assualt rifles at such long ranges and produce a realistic effect.

The very best out of the box "Standard Issue" M16A2 is only capable of about 3 to 4 MOA using standard M855 ball ammo. That's with open sights mind you. They were NEVER intended to be marksman rifles. Hell you can buy an Civilian version M16 (I think it's the AR-15, but I'm not sure) that is more accurate. Standard issue rifles are mass produced by the lowest bidder for that government contract. Most any out of the box hunting rifle is WAY more accurate than a standard Issue M16A2.

US troops zero their M16s at 25 meters not 300 meters and then they use that same zero setting to qualify with. Thats why they record their "Dope". So they can pick up any M16 and put there "dope" on it, so now this weapon is zeroed for them.

[VipersGhost]

Well said rico, so why is everything in PR zero'd at 300 yds? TBH I think most of the time our hunting rifles are zero'd at 100...it's been a while though and we hunt in denser forest. I hope some of the dev's see this, it's nice to have the scopes by they sure are point-click at times. It'd be nice to have to lob your bullets at people...bring in some actual player skill.